When your Hardest Season Builds the Strongest Version of You – with Abbe from Koko Cosmetica

Transcript

[00:00:00] Abbe: I feel like that growth only came from being uncomfortable. Mm.

[00:00:03] Jen: Yeah.

[00:00:04] Abbe: And so now I've created something that I'm so comfortable in. I could stay here forever, but if I stay here forever, I'm not going anywhere. Right? Yeah.

[00:00:12] Samara: you've gotta be uncomfortable. Mm-hmm. And you also have to sit in the uncomfortable Yeah. And really marinate on, on where you're meant to move.

[00:00:19] Jen: We need to trust the people around us. So trusting your older children can become part of the solution instead of a compounding part of your problem.

[00:00:29] Abbe: I really feel like my energy has really shifted, like you always say, you really just have to get through the mud, right?

[00:00:34] Samara: You do have to also enjoy for moments and like you did through your pregnancy.

[00:00:39] Abbe: Yeah, yeah.

[00:00:40] Samara: There are seasons.

[00:00:41] Abbe: Where you just gotta let the

[00:00:42] Samara: cops turn. You just have to enjoy.

[00:00:44] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:00:45] Samara: Yep. Just being still in it,

[00:00:48] Abbe: instead of looking at where everything's lacking, you're just looking at all this abundance and you're like, oh, this is actually beautiful.

So nice. And I did this.

[00:00:56] Jen: You're such a testament to the fact that you can go through really shit times, right? Like you can go through stuff that is so hard, but you then have that choice to take that learning

[00:01:07] Abbe: mm-hmm.

[00:01:07] Jen: And use it to grow and step forward.

[00:01:09] Samara: you have just said the most incredible point that every business owner, every woman, every mother needs to hear

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[00:01:36] Jen: Welcome back to the Inner Sanctum Salon Rising the podcast. Good morning, Sam.

[00:01:41] Samara: Hey, it's been, I feel like it's been a while since we've been in the same room. Richard's already over it. Oh, it has. He's like, I'm already,

he's

[00:01:47] Jen: like, I

[00:01:47] Samara: do

[00:01:47] Jen: not miss

[00:01:48] Samara: these days. He said, I do not miss these days.

[00:01:51] Jen: Yeah, you are welcome. Because I think this is our first time sitting down this year, right?

[00:01:55] Samara: Yes.

[00:01:56] Jen: We, it was on Zoom, obviously.

Our early, podcast that we've done for this year so far have been on Zoom. So it's our first time work-wise sitting down in the same room together,

[00:02:07] Samara: which it's like, excellent. I'll see you as close to like 8 45, 9 o'clock as you can. I was like, I got five kids to drop off. I will see in four different

[00:02:16] Jen: places

[00:02:17] Samara: at 20 past nine at the earliest.

[00:02:19] Jen: Yeah. And I love that you brought cold brew. So

[00:02:22] Samara: yes,

[00:02:22] Jen: that's a topic for another day, but we're all RevD to the eyeballs on coffee this morning, and it's great.

Great.

So we've got a returning guest and I do love our returning guest, but we did talk in jest about you this morning and the fact that we were all gonna have cold brew and that has dairy in it.

And the last time you were on Abbe, we talked about the fact. That you might shoot yourself if you air. So look, it could be a

[00:02:46] Abbe: long

[00:02:46] Jen: drive

[00:02:47] Abbe: to the sunshine

[00:02:49] Samara: and you still were like, oh no, I'm gonna have it.

[00:02:51] Abbe: I'm gonna go away. I had to try it. If it's homemade by you, I had to try it.

[00:02:54] Jen: And I feel like we need to do a reintroduction.

So Abbe has been on the podcast before. Mm-hmm. But is like a completely different person now. So we. Worked out. Looks

[00:03:06] Samara: younger.

[00:03:07] Jen: Yeah.

[00:03:08] Samara: Has had another baby. And looks younger

[00:03:09] Jen: and looks younger. And we all need to know the recipe for that. Not the baby, just the looking younger side of things. So,

[00:03:16] IMG_1979: ' cause

[00:03:16] Jen: the trajectory, we worked out that you were here beginning of 2004.

[00:03:20] Abbe: 2024.

[00:03:21] Samara: Yeah. 2004. Jen, calm down.

[00:03:24] Jen: Sorry. She's still, I was still in the womb. Um, 2024, so

[00:03:29] Abbe: I was eight years old.

[00:03:31] Jen: Let's, let's recap who is sitting next to you and, and let's have a little think about where things were at then.

[00:03:38] Samara: I feel like Abbe needs to do this.

[00:03:40] Jen: Okay. Abbe?

[00:03:41] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:03:42] Jen: Reintroduce yourself please, friend.

[00:03:43] Abbe: So, I'm Abbe, owner of Koko Cosmetica on the Sunshine Coast, I think at the start of 2024. Wow. Where was I?

[00:03:53] IMG_1979: Oof.

[00:03:54] Abbe: I feel like they need to listen. We need to listen to that. Back to that. The outside perspective. Everything has changed, but nothing has changed.

Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, actually that's exactly, yeah, that's exactly how it is. Like I think we spoke about my husband coming back from No, going back to the mines. Was going back to the mines. Yes, back to the mines. So he's still in the mines. I did bring him home briefly, but we're doing the FIFO thing still.

Uh, I'm five years in business this year. Wow. Which is so, so

[00:04:24] Jen: cool.

[00:04:25] Abbe: I remember having a meeting with my accountant in the first year and she's like, you'll know within the first two years if a business is gonna flop or not. And so I was like waiting all for the two years and now it's five and I'm like.

Okay,

[00:04:37] Samara: we're good. We're still standing.

[00:04:39] Abbe: We're still standing.

[00:04:41] Samara: I feel like when people go, like, when do you get to that point where you just like, don't worry. I'm like,

[00:04:45] Jen: oh, I'm sorry

[00:04:46] Samara: I

[00:04:46] Jen: When

[00:04:46] Stereo Mix: you're

[00:04:46] Samara: dead, huh? Yeah. I was like, I've been in business 16 years and I still think, is this the week we fail? Is this, this is the week we go down, isn't it like, and every week it just is fine.

Yeah. And every week I'm like, this is the week, isn't it? This is the week that no one's gonna show up. This is the week. But I feel like that's just

[00:05:01] Abbe: a normal, it somehow just still keeps going,

[00:05:03] Samara: right? Yeah. So you get to the end of the week and you're like, oh, I'm not gonna worry about

[00:05:08] Abbe: Yeah. Good. You're like, okay.

That Monday stress really did me a number, but not much. I've had another baby, but something really cool is I've still got all my same staff. I think that that's massive. Massive.

[00:05:22] Jen: That's so cool.

[00:05:23] Abbe: Yeah. I had to take a pause on my clothing brand, which we spoke about in the last pod. I think just like being a mom, I had, I had to put something down to be able to focus on my salon and being a mom, and I think it was so.

I don't know. I'd conditioned myself from like so much that I see on social media that I needed to have that something else to make myself successful, but mm-hmm. I've realized that you just have to focus on what keeps the cogs turning. Right?

[00:05:54] Samara: Yeah. I love, I

[00:05:55] Abbe: feel for me, love

[00:05:55] Samara: what you just said. I had to put something down down.

Yeah. Like, I think that's a really nice, I had to put that down. Yeah. Like, not, I failed at it. Not, I didn't wanna do it. Not. It got too much, but I just,

[00:06:08] Jen: not that you can ever pick it up again. Again. That's

[00:06:10] Samara: right. And I've still it all,

[00:06:11] Jen: like I've

[00:06:12] Samara: still got it all. I just had to put it down because it just, and I think so many of us, we all try new things all of the time.

Mm-hmm. I am a gun for that. And. You try it and you're like, cool. I did it. I loved it. Yeah, it was cool. Did it work? Yep. Am I good with it now? Yep. Yeah. Okay. Let's move on. Totally. Let's do something else. Or let's have a pause or,

[00:06:34] Abbe: yeah.

[00:06:34] Samara: But I think so often we go, no, I've gotta absolutely whip this in the arse until it's a dead or making billions, instead of just being like, I really enjoyed it for while I did it.

Yeah. And I learned so much about myself.

[00:06:47] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:06:47] Samara: And. What I'm doing and now it's time to put it down.

[00:06:52] Abbe: Absolutely. Yeah. And that's where I got to, 'cause I wasn't giving a hundred percent to the salon. I was making mistakes that I didn't wanna make, like not huge mistakes, just forgetting things that would put the girls behind and mistakes with my kids, like forgetting school things and stuff like that.

But Parker started school in 2024 and I think that's when I was like, no, I just have to, I have to give a hundred percent to my salon and my children. And we'll pick that back up. When,

[00:07:22] Jen: so

[00:07:22] Abbe: whenever,

[00:07:23] Jen: when, so Parker was starting school, when did you find out you were pregnant?

[00:07:28] Abbe: Oh, um, we tried for a little bit.

[00:07:31] Jen: Yeah.

[00:07:31] Abbe: So I think I touched on my postpartum depression. Last podcast

[00:07:35] Samara: we did. Yeah. And this was something that I was like, oh, I would really like, and I think it's rounded to come to you now having another Yeah. Yeah. Like I think it, it is a really powerful conversation of. Where you are at with that, with business when you had the kids and now you're in business, five years in business.

Yeah. And you've got another baby and just,

[00:07:55] Abbe: I have goosebumps just thinking about it because it's so wild.

[00:07:58] Samara: Yeah.

[00:07:59] Abbe: I thought about the third baby for a long time. I think for probably all of 20, 24. I thought about it.

[00:08:04] Samara: I think you kept saying to me like, oh, you just like, that's the goals. I just want three. And I kept saying, don't do it.

Yeah,

[00:08:09] Abbe: don't do it.

[00:08:09] IMG_017408: Don't

[00:08:10] Samara: I

now have five, but don't do that either. But you kept saying, yeah, I feel like I'm just not, I just.

[00:08:17] Abbe: I knew that there was another little soul for me, and I think because of my postpartum depression, I was really kicking myself that that was gonna make up my mind like my bad.

[00:08:29] Samara: Yeah.

[00:08:29] Abbe: Experience was going to make my mind up to shorten my family to what I actually wanted it to be.

[00:08:34] Samara: Did you just get post natal with Bob?

[00:08:39] Abbe: Yep.

[00:08:39] Samara: Yeah. Okay.

[00:08:40] Abbe: Yep. Just him. And then when you look back on it, I bought a business when I, when he was six weeks old.

[00:08:47] Samara: Yes.

[00:08:47] Abbe: I had two staff members that were only there because of the previous owner, because she was amazing to learn off.

Yeah. So I took it over and they didn't wanna be there anymore. And I had to, basically, I had all of this rent, like the rent is what's like 60 KA year, and I was like. Oh, I just gotta make this work somehow with a six week old baby attached to me. And so no wonder really, when you look back, I was going to fall.

[00:09:15] Samara: Yeah. And then you go like, I think this is really powerful for anyone listening, because then you look at it and you go, and I think it's so powerful for you to be like, no, my family's not done. Because you look at it and yes, it was postpartum, but you go, was it that or was it the fact that. At that same time,

[00:09:31] Jen: you're

[00:09:31] Samara: like, being a business is enough, you're in

[00:09:33] Jen: a vulnerable stage,

[00:09:34] Samara: like having a business.

Yeah. You're so vulnerable. And then having a business is enough without having a six week old.

[00:09:41] Jen: Totally.

[00:09:41] Samara: Let alone, like, I think I, I, it would, it'd be interesting to see the stats of like mothers who become mothers and have businesses, what the postpartum depression is like for that, because of the fact that we don't.

Walk out of a job. Yeah. And be like, see you in six months, or see you in 12 months. So we literally are in the hospital room giving birth and then paying the wages. Yes.

[00:10:07] Abbe: No, seriously, when I was, they were putting my, um, induction drip in with Luca and I was like, babe, pay me my phone. I have to pay the girls.

It's Monday.

[00:10:16] Samara: Yeah.

[00:10:16] Abbe: Yeah. He's like, I'm sure they can wait until tomorrow. And I was like, no, no. They need to be paid right now.

[00:10:22] Samara: Yes. And then I will just

[00:10:23] Jen: put, and the reality is you can't leave it till tomorrow.

[00:10:26] Samara: Like who's pay well for the weeks, like

[00:10:30] Abbe: Yeah,

[00:10:30] Samara: yeah. The, it doesn't, it's, whereas, you know, I think it's a, it's both a beautiful blessing, as you would know.

It's both a beautiful blessing and a deep curse because it's a beautiful blessing because you still can have finances coming in and our, our brain can tick over and we have something behind the scenes. But it is a curse at times. I would be like, oh, I'd love to experience a pregnancy that I was just a mom

[00:10:55] IMG_1979: and

[00:10:55] IMG_017408: so

[00:10:55] Samara: totally a birth

[00:10:56] Jen: with this journey and pregnancy.

How did you go afterwards? I have to admit, I like, that's why like when I saw you put things out into the ether that you were happy. Yeah. Yeah. Made my heart happy. Me too. Thank you. Because I was worried. Me too. So how was that postpartum journey for you? This time

[00:11:14] Abbe: it's, it's been. Amazing. Like I could cry about how transformative it's been, honestly.

Like

[00:11:21] Jen: see, this is so good. I know,

[00:11:23] Abbe: yeah. One of my best friends, um, that I've met through school now, she said to me, you are like, 'cause I was like, I don't know, I want this third baby, but I just, I can't put my family through another round of postpartum depression. 'cause as you guys know, nearly broke us or like all of us.

Um, and she was like. You've been through it, now you know what to look out for. Yeah. And you are so strong and you're never going to let yourself experience that again. And that's all that I told myself the whole time. I had an awful pregnancy. It was disgusting, like an awful time. But as soon as he was born, I was just like, yeah, this was so meant to be.

And I'm not ever gonna let myself experience that mentally again. Like I just.

[00:12:10] Samara: You look euphoric,

[00:12:12] Abbe: like how you look. Yeah, I really am. I've never been this calm in my life.

[00:12:15] Samara: You walked. I was like, and I was the same way every time I've watched you and I think there's a very different feeling between knowing like someone putting it on and still putting it on social media, but I can see it in you.

Yeah. Like I was like, I can see and it, and until

you

kind of experience that. And that I was the same with Wyld.

[00:12:38] Jen: Yeah.

[00:12:38] Samara: Like he has healed me in a way that I didn't realize I actually needed.

[00:12:42] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:12:43] Samara: Um, and I remember like looking at, at him after I gave birth to him and just being like, oh, you actually were meant to be here in order to heal.

Like you are meant to be here for that.

[00:12:53] Abbe: Yeah. Like I needed, I, he, Luca went to nicu. So I, for a long time I blamed. The postpartum depression on Oslo's NICU stay.

[00:13:01] Samara: Mm-hmm.

[00:13:02] Abbe: Which was quite short, really, and like perspective. But Luca went to NICU and I had a few moments with Braden where I was like, it's gonna happen again.

It's gonna happen again. And but then it didn't, 'cause I was just like, no, I'm strong. I can get through this. I'm here to be his advocate. I know what I'm doing here. It's only going to be for a short moment, and then we're gonna be at home and it's gonna be beautiful. Like just. So much positive self-talk.

And

[00:13:28] Samara: then,

[00:13:29] Abbe: yeah. And then we get home and it is beautiful. And he's, he's beautiful and it's amazing.

[00:13:33] Samara: Can you talk, I think it's really for anyone who's pregnant or potentially feeling any of these things, what was it for you? 'cause you now know the difference between, you've had three.

[00:13:45] Abbe: Mm-hmm.

[00:13:45] Samara: You know, the difference between all their births and all their journeys.

But with Oslo, what.

What do you think? Obviously you had a business and that was so much pressure. Yeah. But what were the signs now looking back, that you are like, they were signs that I was going into a postnatal

[00:14:00] Abbe: depression. Yeah. I have thought about that a lot. Like, when I, for example, when I'm rocking Luca, it doesn't, it's not a fuss to me.

I'm like, if he doesn't get to sleep right now, it doesn't matter. Whereas with Oslo, I remember being so furious that he wasn't falling asleep, like. Blood boiling steam outta my ears, type of furious, like that sort of thing where just little things that if it didn't go your way seemed like it was the end of the world.

[00:14:25] Jen: so it's more just that capacity to just let the small things go? Yeah. And the age old saying, don't sweat the small stuff, but remembering that this is just a blip. Blip, really. Yeah. A blip.

[00:14:37] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:14:37] Samara: Do you feel that though, the business of being like, 'cause I can think.

I have, I haven't experienced it, but I can think through having a business. The reason why with Oslo, you were like go to sleep is because you had so many other things running through your head Yeah. That you needed to do for the business. Yeah. That you just needed him. Whereas,

[00:14:56] Abbe: yeah, I think at the time I blamed myself, the baby, and the FFO lifestyle.

[00:15:01] IMG_1979: Mm.

[00:15:02] IMG_017408: Mm.

[00:15:02] Abbe: I

blamed that for the depression and for the hard times and for the stress. But when you look back, it was the fact that I had just bought a business.

[00:15:13] Jen: Mm.

[00:15:14] Abbe: I had to train staff. I had to step up and be a big girl with big girl bills. Yeah. And have a baby. But I was using the business at that time in my life to distract me from what was actually going on at home.

Mm. And so I wasn't processing anything properly. I don't think so. I was just constantly in a state of like heightened cortisol. Really? Mm-hmm.

[00:15:35] Jen: Yeah.

I

think too, you're such a testament to the fact that you can go through really shit times, right? Like you can go through stuff that is so hard, but you then have that choice to take that learning

[00:15:49] Abbe: mm-hmm.

[00:15:49] Jen: And use it to grow and step forward. Yeah. Like having another baby or you can just sit on it.

[00:15:55] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:15:55] Jen: And that be the hill that you die on. Mm. Well it was hard and here is where I stopped. Mm-hmm.

[00:16:00] Abbe: Do you know what I mean? Yeah. And I did not want that. 'cause I'm not a quitter.

[00:16:02] Jen: Yeah.

[00:16:03] Abbe: And I didn't wanna get to like.

I'm only young. Right? Like I'm only 29 and I didn't wanna get to like 34 and think I really want that third baby now.

[00:16:11] Jen: Yeah.

[00:16:11] Abbe: Because to me that's a huge gap. Mm-hmm. And I'm like, I didn't wanna do that to my kids and to Braden. And like, I feel, feel like that was gonna be so I had like, I had to be like, no, if I'm going to do it, I've gotta honor what I want my life to look like in 10 years time and I gotta do it now.

[00:16:30] Jen: The really beautiful thing too is that. The biggest change that has happened is your growth.

[00:16:36] Abbe: Mm.

[00:16:37] Jen: Because you still have A-F-I-F-O husband. Yeah. You have more children now.

[00:16:42] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:16:42] Jen: And you still have a business.

[00:16:43] Stereo Mix: Yeah.

[00:16:44] Jen: But it's the growth that you made that meant that this has become a more manageable, and like we said, when you came in the door today, you look.

Like a completely different person in the best, not in an appearance way, but just in the way that you carry yourself.

[00:16:59] Samara: You look, yeah, you look younger, but then you look like you have an air of so much maturity about you at the same time. 100%.

[00:17:07] Abbe: I really feel like my energy has really shifted, like through those, like you always say, you really just have to get through the mud, right?

[00:17:13] Samara: Yeah,

[00:17:14] Abbe: yeah. You gotta push through the mud. And that's how that time felt. And now I'm through it and I'm like, whoa, I'm so glad that I didn't quit.

[00:17:21] Samara: Yeah,

[00:17:21] Abbe: like there was many times where I could have just thrown my hands in the air and stopped the salon or, you know, but I'm glad that I didn't quit because at the end of the day, that's the best thing that I've ever done, and so are my children.

[00:17:34] Jen: Mm.

[00:17:34] Abbe: Yeah, and I think like, I feel like there's so many times in business where as a mother you think being a mom and a business owner can't coexist. Like there's no way that these two can coexist, but they absolutely can. I think you just have to like acknowledge the times where one needs a little bit more attention and this one can kind of wait and then you gotta like, I dunno, it's like a juggling act, right?

Yeah.

[00:18:01] Jen: Seesaw between the two.

[00:18:02] Samara: If you could give yourself advice for back then,

[00:18:07] Abbe: mm-hmm.

[00:18:07] Samara: Because you now have gone through so much growth . So if somebody was feeling how you were feeling at that time with Oslo. Yeah, and it all just felt too heavy and too much, but they still have to go through the mud.

Right. It's, it's, yeah. You know, you, you would go, oh, I probably wouldn't have bought the business then, but you wouldn't have what you have now.

[00:18:25] Abbe: Yeah, no, I absolutely still would've bought the business.

[00:18:28] Samara: Yeah. So if someone was going through that now, yeah. What is some pieces of advice that you would give to someone that was kind of traveling, feeling that way?

Feeling that, because it. When we say this with postnatal, it can not just be postnatal. Like this can be depression. Yeah.

[00:18:46] Abbe: It can be

[00:18:46] Samara: any sort of depression. Depression in so many different forms as well. Yeah,

[00:18:50] Abbe: absolutely.

[00:18:50] Samara: And I resonate that with you with being, like, having the business was a distraction.

[00:18:57] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:18:57] Samara: So you put your energy into the distraction. Yeah. Because life is too hard to face. Yeah. I've, I've traveled that. Yeah. And realized. I, everything was in my business because that's the thing that I could control. Mm-hmm. And also the thing that I feel like I got those sparks of dopamine hit. Yeah, totally.

Whereas like at home, I didn't have it. It was not with my children, it was with my ex marriage. So it was like the business gave me those like thrills.

[00:19:24] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:19:24] Samara: But really, as you said, underneath it all was probably a depression.

[00:19:29] IMG_1979: Yeah.

[00:19:30] Abbe: Yeah. Yeah. I think. Looking back, I think the one thing that I didn't do because I was trying to chase the dopamine hits, was create sustainable habits and sustainable practices with the business.

I went so hard in so fast. I was like doing so much social media, like making so many reels. I was doing so many fun things. I did O Cocoa, like I just produced and produced, and produced all of these things. It wasn't sustainable in the long term. So now. I am finding myself having to like rebuild more sustainable practices as a mom and a business owner.

So perhaps some advice would be to create sustainable changes and sustainable practices that can keep you going, keep you getting little bits of dopamine in your distraction, but also where you're like, if once you do dial back to normal life and you do get through the depression through the mud, you've still got that there that you can.

Focus on and sustain. Mm. Without having to drop it all and start again. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. What's like one sustainable practice that you've put in with your business that you feel like has been like that lifting of pressure for you?

I think for sure it would be popping Charlotte onto doing the ordering.

Yeah. So that was one ball that I was constantly dropping was that I wasn't ordering enough stock and products. Regularly enough. So I like, I give her an allowance and a cocoa card and she. She does the ordering for the salon. And I think that was one of the biggest things to lift a pressure off of me.

So then I can focus on everything else.

[00:21:10] Samara: Allegation. It's the biggest, like taking stock off is the biggest weight that like sits on your shoulders. Totally. Unless you have that designated time. And you and I are such creative, so I'm like, I don't wanna be sitting there doing stock.

[00:21:23] Abbe: No,

[00:21:23] Samara: just doesn't like, but it's like the noise.

And I can come into the girls now and say. Can you do, uh, Woolie's order? We need some oil. Yeah. And they're like, yep, we're already on it. Yeah. And then like the, literally the minute I give it over. Yeah. I'm like,

[00:21:37] Abbe: yeah,

[00:21:37] Samara: thank you. I needed that off my shoulders because. I feel like when stock's missing.

Mm-hmm. Then you feel like a failure. Yeah. You are like, we don't have that. They don't have that. They can't work anymore. I'm dropping the ball.

[00:21:51] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:21:52] Samara: They think I'm failing. And it's the head noise. It's

[00:21:55] Abbe: the head noise is crazy because they probably don't think you're failing. But the fact that, I think the fact that you've had to put a staff member in the position where they're like, oh, I don't have a spooly to like do this.

[00:22:05] Samara: Yes.

[00:22:05] Abbe: To do the service that you are paying them for.

[00:22:08] Samara: Yes.

[00:22:08] Abbe: Then you're like. That would've really annoyed me as an employee.

[00:22:11] Samara: And then I'm like, oh my gosh. And then they're saying to each other, we don't have what we need and it's not sorted.

[00:22:16] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:22:17] Samara: And then you don't, you also realize that when you give it over, you're giving them a sense of this accomplishment job too, that they're here and they're like, I'm gonna do it like.

I'm free. I'm good to do it.

[00:22:27] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:22:28] Samara: Tell me what I've gotta do. Yeah. Put the sustainable boundaries in place. What can I spend? Yeah. What does that look like? How can I support you? And then you also have the opportunity to be so incredibly grateful

[00:22:39] Jen: Yeah.

[00:22:39] Samara: To them, because you're just like, I can't tell you how much that has made my life easier.

[00:22:44] Jen: Yeah.

[00:22:44] Samara: By you doing that for me. Yeah. And I'm really incredibly grateful.

[00:22:48] Jen: Yeah.

[00:22:48] Samara: For me, it's like the bloody end of day. Yeah, all the receipts and all the things and making sure everything balances. Yeah. And I gave that to one of my team members that's leaving now. I have to like,

[00:22:59] Jen: oh,

[00:23:00] Samara: give it to someone else.

Someone else pick it up myself. And she's just like, oh, I've got it done sorted. And I just get all the. Air pops bags I need. And it just, every time I think, I think, oh God, I'm grateful. Mm-hmm. And like that's the energy then you're sending out Yeah. All the time.

[00:23:15] Jen: And it also allowing someone else to feel like they are contributing and supporting you, like Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Like, you know, I think so often I hear like, oh, you know, well I, someone's not gonna do it. Right? It's like, well, are you allowing people to, to live to what you want? You know, like, are you actually. Creating those sustainable practices and foundations so that someone has that opportunity to achieve in something you don't have time for.

Yeah. You know, like it gives

[00:23:38] Abbe: him, it gives him a little bit of sense of purpose, I think. Sure. And like to not feel, I think especially in the hairdressing, or I can't speak for the hairdressing industry, but definitely in the beauty industry, it would be really easy to come into a job and maybe feel like there's like a very short ceiling Yes.

[00:23:55] Jen: Of where you can go, yeah. Of where you can go.

[00:23:56] Abbe: Yeah. So I feel like giving a little bit extra, responsibility helps 'em to feel like they're actually doing a proper job.

[00:24:04] Samara: Yeah.

[00:24:05] Abbe: I love that because beauty is all creative. Like what we do is all creative. It's all fun.

[00:24:09] Samara: Yep.

[00:24:10] Abbe: I think would be really easy for the girls.

I know it's really easy for the girls to fall into the trap of being like, well, I don't have a big girl job.

[00:24:16] Samara: Yes.

[00:24:18] Abbe: Because I'm just coming to work to hang out with my friends and chit chat and laugh. Do these beautiful brows and lashes. Yeah. Which they do an amazing job of. But I do understand that, that like.

[00:24:27] IMG_1979: Like

[00:24:28] Abbe: There's gotta be more if they want purpose out of their career. Yeah. And you are also building that foundation for them to understand the ins and outs of what a part of their career is that they wanna go on and do something like you've done. Yeah. You know, like they, they're not walking in thinking like it's just gonna be shits and giggles and nice brows and lashes.

[00:24:45] Jen: Yeah. There's actually things that you need to do in the background, like running your stock, like doing those other little bits and pieces like your end of days where you've offered them that insight mm-hmm. Into the extras involved.

[00:24:56] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:24:56] Jen: In. Taking that next step of That's what they want to do.

[00:25:00] Abbe: Yeah. In their journey.

And honestly they, I, with my terrible pregnancy, I think I left work at 24 weeks and I basically didn't go in until he was born. And Andy and Charlotte had it

[00:25:11] IMG_017408: absolutely

[00:25:12] Abbe: absolutely under wraps.

[00:25:13] IMG_1979: Like

[00:25:14] Abbe: I basically didn't hear from them. They just let me. Deal. And I think that was also a huge part of me not getting postpartum depression again as well 'cause they saw me go through it the first time. Mm. And I think they stepped up so much because they were like, no, no. You, so,

[00:25:30] Jen: but also a testament to you having those systems and processes in place

[00:25:34] Abbe: mm-hmm.

[00:25:35] Jen: For things to still run smoothly when you weren't there.

[00:25:38] Abbe: Yeah, we definitely, I think in the 2024 I focused a lot on making sure that things were palmed off.

I gave Andy social media. Charlotte was running the stock and the ordering, and Charlotte was also doing a lot of like front facing for me as well. And Andy was like replying on social media. So yeah, I had kind of front end and backend taken care of throughout 2024, so I was able to like fall pregnant and then, yeah,

[00:26:05] Samara: and I just, I think, yeah.

We've always, we've said this before on the podcast, is make a whole list of things that you don't, that you have to do. Like just make the entire list of everything that you have to do be in a business.

[00:26:17] Abbe: Actually, I think you said that to me before because I did get Charlotte to write a list of things that she thought that I was dropping the ball in.

[00:26:23] Samara: Yeah.

[00:26:23] Abbe: And that she, and a list that she thought she could be fine to take over.

[00:26:28] Samara: Yep.

[00:26:28] Abbe: And that's how we separated it.

[00:26:29] Samara: And I think you also have to be careful with it. If you're asking people to tell you what you're dropping the ball in, just be careful because it's gonna hurt your feelings. Yeah, yeah. But it's gonna help you go if they're like, okay, you're dropping the ball here, meaning we're struggling with this.

Yeah. How can we take it over? Yeah. What are the systems in place? Yeah. Because I think the systems that you put in place are also important. It has to be planned systems. Yeah. It can't just be like, okay, here you go, you're doing this. Stock now Enjoy. Which is what I did once. Yeah. And it took me 12 months to sell out of some Christmas packs from that.

Yeah. You know, I was just like, and also thousands upon thousands of dollars of over ordering of stock. Yeah. You know, so the important thing is, is 80% of that before you even do it, is planning. Yeah. It is. What are you doing? Are you putting a budget in place? Mm-hmm. How much of everything do you want? You know, when can they up the stock?

What can they spend? You know, all of the things first.

[00:27:22] Abbe: Well, yeah. You've gotta new numbers first. Right. And then

[00:27:24] Samara: That's

[00:27:25] Abbe: right.

[00:27:26] Samara: That's what it always comes about. Always comes to your numbers,

[00:27:29] IMG_1979: yourself

[00:27:30] Samara: and then implementing that. Yeah. You know, it can't just be like a, let's do this. It's all the planning that happens behind it.

So that it can roll out successfully, so those systems actually stick. Totally. There was many times where I was like, I'm just gonna take that back over. Yes. And then they'd have to be like, no, no, don't. Yes, we've got it. Just tell me. Yeah. If something is annoying, you tell me how I can adjust it to make it better so that you don't want to take it back.

[00:28:00] Abbe: Yeah. You have to. I think you've gotta lead with control, but also be able to lead and let go. Yes. Of some things. Uh, the same thing applies to motherhood. Totally. Yes. You know, sometimes you feel like I'm really on top of it and I'm like, oh. I'm like, oh, this's amazing. Like, I'm just killing motherhood like a boss.

[00:28:18] Samara: Mm-hmm. I walked to the creek yesterday with the kids and I was like, oh, killing it. My house may burn down 'cause there's two air fries currently going in the, the mix and I'm walking to the creek. Let's just hope it's still standing when we get back. Please, Lord, make sure my house is still standing when we get back.

But I was like, oh no, this is great. I'm totally killing it. Yeah. But that moment of doing that with the kids, it brought us all so much joy. Like we had the best afternoon in the creek, but it meant when I got home that it was 10 to seven and dinner wasn't done. Mm-hmm. It was done, but they had to eat. We had to get their teeth brushed.

It takes 45 years to get five kids to bed because they're all being tools and.

[00:29:00] IMG_1979: all

[00:29:01] Samara: the washing needed to go on the lunch pack needs to be, yeah. So I had to be like mentally prepare myself that I'm like, while I give us as a family this snippet of joy, it does mean that when we get home, I can't just be like, oh, it's a Sunday afternoon, I'm just gonna chill because for those next three hours it was like lunches prepping because without those systems, without prepping my week.

Everything. Yeah. When you have kids and you're doing a business, everything falls apart on the wayside. Yeah. Like if I'm not prepped at home, yeah. I cannot be prepped in the business.

[00:29:35] Abbe: No. And it's all to do with your head, hey. Yeah. It's gotta be clear, like you've gotta have a clear path for the week. Yes.

To get it done.

[00:29:42] Samara: I would love to know, is there any strategies that you have for that? Like that balancing obviously like you're just in the, Luke is only bug. Yeah. But like right now or even before he was born. How do you feel? Like, as you said, it's a complete juggle. Yeah. And And sometimes I think you have to be okay with the fact that sometimes you will fail in one area because the other area is where you need to be.

Yeah. And vice versa. Mm-hmm. But I would love to know, is there any like processes or strategies you've put in place between motherhood and business that's really helped you? 'cause we've looked at the business. Yeah. But what about motherhood for you?

[00:30:18] Abbe: I think separating the two completely. I used to, when I was building the business, when Oslo was. Little, I was going to daycare, picking them up and coming back and doing clients, so I would have them in the salon. I would feel like a terrible mother because my kids are out the back having takeaway butter chicken for dinner. And I would also feel like a terrible business owner because my staff were having to juggle them between clients and then my clients were having to listen to screaming kids.

Mm. Yeah. So separating the two. The kids don't come to work with me if I'm working. If if we're just popping in, they'll come to the salon. But if I'm working, they're not with me. I only work in the hours that they're at school or in daycare.

[00:30:57] Samara: Yeah.

[00:30:57] Abbe: Or someone else has them like Braden when he's home. I listened to a lot of podcasts when I was trying to get myself out of that postpartum depression and even after, because obviously you've, it's a long recovery, so, yeah.

That. What's that podcast that Alex Alexa, Alexis Pereira or something. Do you fucking mind?

[00:31:18] Jen: Oh yes.

[00:31:19] Abbe: Yeah, yeah. She had one where it was like five, like name five things that need to be done to make your like world feel easier in the morning and start developing those. So literally as simple as doing the dishwasher at night.

Yes. That's something I would never do 'cause I'd be exhausted from being a FIFO mom. And a business owner and just all the rest. And so I would then I'd wake up in the morning, I'd be like, and you wake up in

[00:31:41] Jen: chaos.

[00:31:42] Abbe: Yeah. 'cause nothing was done.

[00:31:44] Samara: Yeah.

[00:31:44] Abbe: So something simple as making the bed, doing the dishwasher at nighttime.

[00:31:48] Samara: But I think even what you said then, I think there's so much power in that listen to podcasts. Yeah. They cost you nothing.

[00:31:55] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:31:56] Samara: Instead of being in your own space and scrolling on social media. Yeah.

[00:31:59] Jen: Yeah.

[00:31:59] Samara: And that, that's been a huge one for me this year is completely dropping social media and how much that consumes my brain.

Why not listen to a podcast? Yeah. Instead that, even if it's only in the background. Yeah. And getting in Jen's car yesterday and it's just like, oh, Steven Bartlett's hanging out with Jen.

[00:32:17] Jen: I listen to a lot of stuff.

[00:32:19] Samara: That's what I mean. Yeah. Even if you pick up one tiny percent of, from a podcast saying, well, listen to the podcast guys, but if you listen to one tiny percent of someone's podcast.

Yeah. It's just that like, it's just that knowledge and there's so much free resource to that. It totally, it's like ask people what the favorite podcast is. Yeah. I'm always saying, Jenna text me this morning was like, what was that? What's that podcast I need to listen to? Yeah. And

[00:32:43] Jen: I did listen to that podcast this morning as well.

Did

[00:32:45] Samara: you love

[00:32:46] Jen: Yeah, I did. I really enjoyed it.

[00:32:47] Samara: Yeah. There's so much that you're just like, oh, I needed to hear that then. Yeah. I needed, instead of getting in my car and driving home. With music on or calling someone. The other day I put something on a podcast on, and it literally spoke at me that I was like.

I hear you.

[00:33:03] Abbe: Yeah,

[00:33:04] Samara: I hear this. Mm-hmm. And I needed that. There's so much knowledge in it. So much, much power. Like you just, you were like that five things. Yeah. We all know this. Especially

[00:33:12] Jen: I think too, when Yeah,

[00:33:12] Samara: we all know it. Yeah. We know that putting the dishwasher on the night before and cleaning the kitchen's gonna be far better.

[00:33:17] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:33:18] Samara: But hearing sometimes you just need

[00:33:20] Jen: a reminder. Yeah. Yeah. And also I think too, it's a great way to access that information at a time, especially in that postpartum time. When you feel really isolated.

[00:33:29] Samara: Yes.

[00:33:29] Jen: You know, you feel locked in and isolated. Mm-hmm. And you, you may not have access to groups and community.

[00:33:35] Abbe: Well, yeah. They say like, put yourself, if you wanna grow, put yourself in rooms with people better than you. Yes. But like, you can't always do that. Exactly. Yeah. Podcasts and things like, you're technically putting yourself in a room, in the

[00:33:46] Samara: room

[00:33:47] Abbe: and you're having those conversations if like, even though you're not a part of them.

And

[00:33:50] Samara: it's like, Jen, I've constantly said it's that little 1%. Just putting the dishwasher on.

[00:33:54] Abbe: Yeah,

[00:33:54] Samara: just put the dishwasher

[00:33:55] Abbe: on. It really is. And that doesn't, I don't think to a, oh, I was 25. 25-year-old mother with a brand new business basically, and two small kids.

[00:34:04] Samara: Yep.

[00:34:05] Abbe: The dishwasher doesn't really seem that big.

[00:34:07] Samara: But it's huge.

[00:34:08] Abbe: But it's huge.

[00:34:09] Samara: Yeah.

[00:34:09] Abbe: It really is huge.

[00:34:10] Samara: It's

[00:34:10] Jen: that we, a girlfriend of mine, how it feels the next morning is

[00:34:12] Abbe: huge.

[00:34:12] Samara: Yeah, yeah.

[00:34:13] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:34:13] Samara: A girlfriend of mine, when we were, I was visiting her with the kids, she put up a song called Pack Up Time, and it's like, pack up time. It's so Aussie. Feel free to Google it, like to listen to it on Spotify with your kids.

But even putting that song on

[00:34:28] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:34:28] Samara: And saying to my kids, all right, let's pack up time. Let's do this. Yeah. Yesterday we were the same. We got home and we'd spent like the yesterday out, and we're very conscious on the kids of making sure that.

[00:34:38] IMG_1979: that

[00:34:39] Samara: They make the mess. So like, contribute to Yeah. What it looks like.

Yeah. So we wrote a whole list on the whiteboard. Mm-hmm. Um, really about a whiteboard in our house with older children. A whole list on the whiteboard and we were like, go ham, your rooms have to be clean and then all of these neat things need to get done. My eldest did most of them, and then our second eldest, and then the, my daughter was like, my youngest was lying on the lounge, like rolling and, but it all got done. It moved out of my head space. Yeah. And then I can go into this week being like, oh, I can breathe. Yeah. Because I don't know anyone that can, and I know at Christmas time mm-hmm. It can handle like this. Like, but if you are swinging into the week with no food in the fridge, oh yeah. Lunchbox is not sorted.

You are washing not done. Yeah. Because you've had a fat weekend. Yeah. I'm sorry. I can't anymore. And I, it, yeah. Means that I have to give up something like lying on my bed and watching Bridgeton, it means that I have to give that up in order to get prepped for my week. But I tell you, if I was not prepped, there's no way I'm getting out of that house.

[00:35:44] Jen: I think too, the important thing there and, and something that you've both touched on, Abbe, in the sense like. From business and yours in the sense from home is that we need to trust the people around us. So trusting your older children can become part of the solution instead of a compounding part of your problem.

Trusting that your team and your salon can be part of the solution of what is actually stressing you out, but also allowing them to potentially not do it as well as you could.

[00:36:14] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:36:14] Jen: At first,

[00:36:15] Abbe: yeah,

[00:36:15] Jen: because imperfection is did

[00:36:17] Samara: grow. Oh yeah. I did write vacuuming three times on the list. 'cause the first one was bad, the second one was okay.

And the third one we just got there.

[00:36:22] Jen: But if we are never allowing people to learn and grow to lift to the standards that perhaps we have set, then we will never limit the noise.

[00:36:30] Samara: Mm.

[00:36:31] Abbe: Oh, exactly. Like last night I was reading a book with Parker, she was reading the book and I wanted so many times to be like, just let me read it babe.

Just let, let me read it to you. But. But yeah, she needs, she needed that time to, to

[00:36:45] Samara: today, junior.

[00:36:49] Abbe: Literally.

[00:36:49] Samara: That's probably. What the higher power aboves looking at us doing. Like, come on, you know, to pack the dish.

[00:36:55] IMG_1979: like

[00:36:57] Samara: You a lesson.

[00:36:59] IMG_1979: Come on.

[00:36:59] Samara: Come on. Do you really need more lessons? Like that's what they're like, come on. Yeah, no, totally. I feel like I had something so good to say, but it's.

[00:37:10] IMG_017408: thanks.

[00:37:11] Samara: That's all right. That's motherhood day. We asked,

[00:37:14] IMG_017408: if

[00:37:15] IMG_1979: ask

[00:37:16] Samara: to come back in please. But yeah, it's just for me, it was the lunchboxes last year. Mm-hmm. I feel like I yelled at the kids ev 'cause I was done with doing the lunchboxes in the morning. I have all these grand plans of getting up at 5 30, 6 every single, and I, every night I go to bed.

Fully recharge. Mm-hmm. Like getting up at six. I'm gonna do some stretching, I'm gonna do all the things I need to do.

[00:37:37] IMG_1979: and

[00:37:38] Samara: then I actually wake up at like 10 to seven because I just turn it off. 'cause I'm too tired. Yeah. Yeah. So it's like how do you prep yourself the night before when you've got that energy?

Yeah. And for me it was lunchbox. Yeah. Like just do 'em, we've set up a separate fridge, just do them and have them away. Yeah. And I can't tell you how much that stopped me from yelling at the kids and being a better mom. Yeah. Because I'm not screaming at them all morning. Yeah. Because the other like, I think sometimes, and the same thing we said with business, sometimes the things that we do, uh, we still have to keep hold of.

We're better at it. Yeah. Yeah. Absolute. We can do faster and more efficiently in our businesses and like I know the. Socials for me, the Instagram, I can do that so efficiently. I know how I like it done and it's better for me to keep it. Yeah. Because I know that process. Yeah. I can get the girls to help me with everything behind the scenes.

[00:38:28] Jen: Yeah. But I know it doesn't mean you can't delegate aspects of that out. Agreed. It's like, you know, the other week I had a staff member that was quiet. I was like, I need these specific things.

[00:38:39] Samara: Yep.

[00:38:39] Jen: Filmed for me. Yes. Mm-hmm. So that I can very quickly and efficiently Yes. Put the socials together coming forward.

Yes. So like, yeah,

[00:38:46] Samara: those things,

[00:38:46] Jen: you know, like

[00:38:47] Samara: I made, oh, and it chunk it

[00:38:49] Jen: down.

[00:38:49] Samara: I made Alba make muffins yesterday. I was like, can you make some muffins? I just need to finish Bridgeton, can you make these muffins? And I'll check. And she's like, mom, I feel really proud that I followed all the instructions and I made them.

Oh yeah. And that means that that's done for me for the week. I don't have to do it. Yeah. They've got it. They're all over it. She feels proud. Yeah. And then lunch boxes are easy to do. Yeah. Because everything's ready to go. Yeah. But that's what it's, it's both. It's delegating between both. And some people can't do that.

If you've got a baby as small as Luca, you cannot delegate him to make some look at why you're not vacuuming.

[00:39:20] IMG_017408: broke.

[00:39:21] Abbe: Can't even roll because he's so fat. He's just like, oh.

[00:39:27] Samara: But it doesn't turtle on his back. Yeah.

[00:39:30] IMG_017408: but.

[00:39:31] Samara: The instances you can do, like with Parker?

[00:39:34] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:39:34] Samara: The things that she can take responsibility for and how you set that up.

So she has systems. She

[00:39:39] Abbe: loves responsibility

[00:39:40] Samara: too. Thrive on it and like I think systems, systems for our kids are good. Yeah. The white, they love my whiteboard because it means that they have a clear plan and sometimes it's writing. Get dressed on that whiteboard so they can tick it off. Yeah. But sometimes I write do wages, even though I know I need to do them so I can tick them off.

[00:39:59] Jen: I literally do that every week on my to-do list. Yeah. 'cause I just like the satisfaction of knowing that I got something done.

[00:40:04] Samara: Agreed. So our kids are the same.

[00:40:06] Jen: Do I need to remind myself that I need to do them? No.

[00:40:08] Samara: Yeah.

[00:40:08] Jen: But if it's on my list and I take it, I feel successful. Yeah. It's very

[00:40:11] Abbe: satisfying.

[00:40:12] Jen: Yeah, for

[00:40:12] Samara: sure. And I think, I like the thing that you said. Sometimes you just gotta. Do that one thing, and if it takes a little bit more time, I noticed this yesterday. Do that one thing. We talk about that, of closing the loop of the things that are going through your brain. Yeah, yeah. You know, whether it's making a costume for Parker that she needs.

Yeah. And just focusing on that and doing it and being done with it. Yeah. For me, it's my underwear drawer at the moment. It's driving me nuts. I just need to take it out, tidy it out, and then every time I open it, I'll be like.

[00:40:39] IMG_017408: Because

[00:40:40] Samara: I

find in my house areas get like that for me too. Yeah. Do you find that and in your business

[00:40:44] Jen: think we should always be doing one area?

Yes. I think there's always like an area that needs to, like you just need to move around. There should always be an a little area Yes. In the side that we're working on. Yeah. Because that like smaller rather than waiting till all the areas need doing. Yeah. You know? Yeah.

[00:40:59] Samara: And then you do it and it doesn't feel, so we did the garage yesterday again for the 94th time, but.

And lady's like, oh, it actually only took me three hours. I wasn't setting aside entire weekend

[00:41:09] Jen: because you

[00:41:10] Samara: haven't been waited entire weekend for

[00:41:11] Jen: this.

[00:41:11] Samara: You know, like it's, it's not like garage all the things, but like spice draws and stuff like that. I'm like, oh, it's driving me nuts. And that's the loop that stages in your head.

Yeah. Spice draws aren't done, haven't done that. And you would find that now with having three little ones in the business.

[00:41:25] Abbe: Yeah. Yeah. You just have to, you gotta start somewhere. Hey.

[00:41:29] Samara: Yeah.

[00:41:29] Jen: Yes.

I think the success that you feel. From completing that one small task. Yeah.

Actually builds the momentum.

[00:41:36] Abbe: It does. To carry

[00:41:37] Jen: into

[00:41:37] Abbe: the big ones because then you're like, right, I can, I can keep doing that.

[00:41:39] Jen: Yeah.

[00:41:39] Samara: That's the dopamine here.

[00:41:41] Abbe: Yeah, for

[00:41:41] Samara: sure. Yeah.

[00:41:42] Abbe: I've reflected a lot, I think, on my massive growth in the business in that time that I was suffering with postpartum depression and I've

really reflected this year because last year I've completely wrote last year off to just building a baby and birthing a baby. That was all I, I could do

[00:42:00] Jen: enough. Yeah.

[00:42:00] Abbe: That was enough.

[00:42:02] Jen: It's a big job.

[00:42:02] Abbe: Yeah, it's a huge job. But I feel like, I feel like that growth only came from being uncomfortable. Mm.

[00:42:10] Jen: Yeah.

[00:42:10] Abbe: And so now I've created something that I'm so comfortable in. I could stay here forever, but if I stay here forever, I'm not going anywhere. Right? Yeah. And so how long can I sustain this forever if it's not growing? But I feel like I need something to make me a little bit uncomfortable again. You know what, a

[00:42:30] Samara: point bit.

[00:42:30] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:42:31] Samara: And then you're like, also, I'm not calling that in. Don't make me, don't make this. Not

[00:42:35] Abbe: yet, but I'm

[00:42:36] Jen: not aware.

[00:42:36] Abbe: I know just

[00:42:37] Jen: not now,

[00:42:37] Abbe: but I work better when I'm under pressure. I find.

[00:42:40] Samara: Yes.

[00:42:41] Jen: It's this philosophy that two of the core things that we need in life, is certainty and uncertainty. Mm-hmm.

Because you need that. A certain amount of certainty. But if you were to go into a casino, like casinos would fail if you pulled like the thing on the poke machine every time.

[00:42:57] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:42:57] Jen: And you always won.

[00:42:59] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:42:59] Jen: Because the drive and the certainty actually becomes boring.

[00:43:04] Stereo Mix: Totally.

[00:43:04] Jen: So everybody needs that element of uncertainty and a mix.

Totally. And that's when you'll actually grow. So you can feel comfortable on the certain Yeah. But at some point the certain will feel. Unfulfilling. Mm. Yes. 'cause you need an element of uncertainty to keep thriving forward. Yeah. Yeah. In your life.

[00:43:21] Abbe: Yeah,

[00:43:21] Jen: yeah,

[00:43:22] Abbe: yeah. We've been talking about it a lot in like the first month of this year because, um, again, like the girls have been with me for five years this year, so they're really comfortable in their job.

They love coming to work. Like I've created a space that's very comfortable to come in. They know that they get paid properly. They know that it's fun. They know that their best friends are there, and a like. Definitely two of them are feeling like, oh, well, what's like,

[00:43:47] Jen: what's

[00:43:47] Abbe: next? What's next? But both of them have said to me that they struggle to find like the drive to get to what's next.

And that's what's made me reflect, and I think it's probably where I'm at in business too. 'cause I need to propel it forward. My lease is ending this year. I need to find a new space and I wanna buy a space.

I've gotta do all that, but it's so comfy right here where we're Yeah. Yeah. Like it's so nice and nothing goes wrong.

[00:44:10] Samara: You do have to also enjoy for moments and like you did through your pregnancy.

[00:44:15] Abbe: Yeah, yeah.

[00:44:16] Samara: There are seasons.

[00:44:18] Abbe: Where you just gotta let the

[00:44:19] Samara: cops turn. You just have to enjoy.

[00:44:21] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:44:22] Samara: Yep. Just being still in it, making sure it all still runs and being really grateful for those still moments. 'cause I think you have just said the most incredible point that every business owner, every woman, every mother needs to hear is that the growth comes in the uncomfortable, and none of us want to go through the uncomfortable.

No. But afterwards you're like, huh.

[00:44:46] Abbe: And

[00:44:46] Samara: you did that kick in the ass. I learned so much from that. But in it, you're like, this is gross

[00:44:52] Jen: bullshit.

[00:44:53] Samara: It's sticky, it's yuck. I don't like it how it feels. And then afterwards you're like, huh. So you know, you've gotta have like that kind of coasting. Yeah. And then that rocky bit that makes you propel to that next

[00:45:06] Abbe: level.

Yeah, and I really did enjoy it last year. I really made the most of feeling comfortable and staying exactly. Where we were.

[00:45:13] Jen: But that's really insightful as well, because how many people don't enjoy that peaceful, quiet season?

[00:45:20] Abbe: Well, yeah. It's not really in my personality, to be

[00:45:22] Jen: honest. Do you know what I mean?

Like how many people go miss that?

[00:45:25] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:45:25] Jen: Joy in that moment.

[00:45:27] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:45:27] IMG_017408: Yeah.

[00:45:28] Jen: Because they don't have that fear and drive to be moving forward. Like just being able to sit

[00:45:32] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:45:33] Jen: And be really, really happy with where you are.

[00:45:34] Abbe: And you're right, it does make you feel so much more grateful for everything. 'cause instead of like, instead of looking at where everything's lacking, you're just looking at all this abundance and you're like, oh, this is actually beautiful.

So nice. And I did this.

[00:45:47] Jen: Yeah. Yes.

[00:45:50] Abbe: Amazing.

[00:45:50] Jen: Yep.

[00:45:51] Abbe: But yeah, I think 2026, I need, I need a little kick in the bum to get things going again.

[00:45:56] Samara: Yeah. But I think again, seasons. Yeah.

[00:45:59] Jen: And you have thi, like you say, there's, there's things that are happening within your business structure that will propel you to make change anyway.

Yeah. Like you have a forced change coming. Yeah. You know that that lease movement will propel that change. Yeah. So,

[00:46:12] Abbe: yeah.

[00:46:12] Samara: And sometimes you have to sit in it and just be like.

[00:46:15] IMG_1979: Just

[00:46:16] Samara: W just wait for the answer. Like, I think sometimes so often we're like, gotta make this decision now. But sometimes you just have to sit it and be like, okay, what is the answer?

[00:46:26] Abbe: That's something businesses really taught me is to just like, wait it out.

[00:46:30] Samara: Even with this place, it was so like I, when the rent was increased.

[00:46:36] IMG_1979: I

[00:46:37] Samara: I was like, do I move? And I looked online, there was nothing. Yeah. I was like, okay, that's a good answer for me. Yeah. Like, but if you are just like, that's it, I'm moving, I'm leaving here.

And then you try and find something you can't find, like, I think you really have to also just marinate on it and, and do what? The right thing for you? For me it's prayer. It might be meditation, it might be, yeah, seeing a psychologist. Mm-hmm. Those things to have those questions out, but I think sometimes you just put it down,

[00:47:04] Jen: see how it feels.

[00:47:05] Samara: Yeah. You just have to like, what does that actually look like and what can I hold right now? The thought of me at that time while going through still a court case with in personally was. There was no way I would've had the capacity to move. To move this space. Yeah. And not lose my mind.

[00:47:24] Jen: So you put that down for a while.

[00:47:26] Samara: So I put it down it, down, down. For a while. I was like, okay, I have to, I have to actually just decide what feels the most comfortable. Yeah. And this feels comfortable and this I'm okay with. So we do that and now I have more space and time to be like, okay, how am I? How am I adapting? Yeah. What is that gonna look like for me now?

And there is a reason I've been pushed in this direction. Yeah. So I think. Exactly what you said is you've gotta be uncomfortable. Mm-hmm. And you also have to sit in the uncomfortable Yeah. And really marinate on, on where you're meant to move.

[00:47:56] Abbe: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, there was no way that I could have.

Had a clothing brand, a salon, salon, and a third baby.

[00:48:01] Samara: Yes.

[00:48:02] Abbe: I had to put that clothing brand down and a FIFO husband and a FIFO husband, and unfortunately he can't be put down.

[00:48:14] Samara: Sorry Brandon. We love you.

[00:48:15] Abbe: We love you. Um, but yeah, and like that was uncomfortable too in making that decision to close down that Instagram and like, I still have a loan on those products. Like I've, I've gotta restart it somehow or start paying that back. Like that's uncomfortable as well as deciding that you need to put something down to be a little bit more comfortable somewhere else.

Like

[00:48:36] Samara: yes.

[00:48:37] Abbe: You know? But I think, yeah, absolutely. You have to let yourself be a little bit uncomfortable in order to grow as a person.

[00:48:43] Samara: Also, sometimes you're going to lose money and. Fuck up and make a decision that you're like, eh, I probably shouldn't have done that, and it's only going to strip. Mm-hmm.

Like, you were so passionate mm-hmm. When we worked together about building, creating o coco clothing.

[00:48:56] Abbe: Oh my God. I'm, I'm still like, I'm still so passionate about it. I just think that I probably went the wrong direction,

[00:49:02] Samara: I think. Or

[00:49:02] Abbe: not even,

[00:49:03] Samara: I think as you said though, yeah. I think it's like one of those ones that you're like, I have to do it because it's what's in me right now.

But not realizing that it wasn't, you didn't have the full capacity for it. Yeah. But yep. As you said, there's a loan there, but it will get paid off because it will. And also,

[00:49:17] Jen: You learned a lot in that, and I think this, I did this whole idea of failure because perhaps that idea that you went with wasn't the right one.

Yeah, yeah. But what did you learn? Like the

[00:49:26] Abbe: Yeah,

[00:49:26] Jen: I don't, I genuinely don't believe that.

And

it's a big call to make. I don't believe that we're ever failing. 'cause we're always learning. Not always lesson, you know what I mean? If something doesn't work, it doesn doesn't, lesson doesn't. But I mean, you have the opportunity to not do it.

Yeah. And stay exactly where you are. I mean, is that even living? Yeah.

[00:49:49] Samara: You know? Yeah. I think you would still be thinking about it and being like, is that my, and I think sometimes you have to pick it up in order to be like, huh. Actually not what I, when I wanted to educate, I wanted to teach.

[00:50:00] Jen: Yes. Yeah.

[00:50:00] Samara: And I was like, oh.

It's like my whole focus was like traveling for education. And again, I think it was a distraction traveling and I did it and I was like, Ugh.

[00:50:09] IMG_1979: but

[00:50:10] Samara: I don't like this. This doesn't actually, yeah.

[00:50:12] IMG_1979: But

[00:50:13] Samara: But I had this idea of what it was gonna look like and when I did it, I was like, it's not what I want.

[00:50:18] Jen: It was the, it was being around the community of the people and supporting people.

Yes. That's what it was.

[00:50:22] Abbe: Yes. Another do being hit. Right.

[00:50:24] Samara: But it was more so that it was, salon Rising was a better call for it. Yeah. Because I had, I can have more structure. Mm-hmm. And I can say yes and no to things traveling. I'm like, I actually hate leaving my house. I don't know why. I never thought that that was a good idea.

Staying

[00:50:38] Abbe: away, like time away from your children. Yep. And things like that. That's not like staying true to you.

[00:50:42] Samara: Yeah.

[00:50:43] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:50:43] Samara: And you just see a highlight reel and you think, no, I really wanna do that. I really wanna do those things. And I did love it while I did it, but there's, it's just you have to be like.

I've experienced it and actually it's not right. Mm-hmm. And I'm gonna, I'm glad that they did it.

[00:50:59] Jen: You

also

found, and you also found the parts of it that you really did enjoy.

[00:51:02] Samara: Yeah.

[00:51:02] Jen: And you moved that onto the next thing. Yeah. Because I think there's that whole idea that if you've started something. Like we said before.

Yeah. I'm not a quitter. I'm not a quitter. I, it's like, well, you're not quitting. No. You've just grown past that now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Your life and your situation has grown past that. Therefore, it's time to put that down. Yeah. I'm taking that one. I'm gonna run with that for sure. We're

[00:51:21] Samara: gonna say, put that down a lot.

[00:51:22] Jen: Put that, love that down.

[00:51:23] Samara: We're gonna say it as much as boundaries. We've put it down.

[00:51:27] Jen: Yeah. Abbe. Abbe. Put that one down. Abbe. Love that. She Who put that down? Yeah.

[00:51:31] Abbe: Um.

[00:51:33] Jen: See, I totally lost my train. Train of thought. Sorry. I was just thinking about putting things down.

[00:51:40] Abbe: Jen's gonna put everything down.

[00:51:41] IMG_1979: So many

[00:51:42] Jen: So many things. I'm just putting it down at the moment. If I put it down, Nana picks it up, so that's okay. Perfect.

we are reaching the end of our time. Today. It's never enough, is it?

It's never enough. It's never enough. I, I'm excited to see how you, I'm so excited you,

you, your growth

[00:52:02] Samara: your growth in the next 12 months, because I know even for me, like you birth a baby and then you just birthed this new, I held onto that the whole pregnancy, I must say. You said in, well, our first ever one-on-one. You're like, I've birthed this baby and now I've birthed a whole business and a whole new version of me, and I'm like.

[00:52:19] Abbe: Perfect. Aw, see, you just, yeah. That's what's gonna happen. Yeah. And it you do. You do. Yeah. 'cause you have a, a new sense of clarity and purpose and Yeah. Peace that you're like, okay, I'm good to pick that up. Yeah. Cool. Let's go. Yeah.

[00:52:33] Jen: I've gotta say though, the clarity, purpose, and peace that you have at your age

[00:52:39] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:52:39] Jen: Is incredible. Agreed.

[00:52:42] Abbe: Yeah. It's quite invaluable. Hey.

[00:52:44] Jen: Oh

[00:52:44] Abbe: my gosh. I feel like just, yeah,

I'm very. Extremely grateful for where I am at my age and like the, the hard things that I've put myself through to be able to get here because I basically, I'm turning 30 this year and I have everything. That was on 20-year-old ME'S vision board.

I have, I have it all. I genuinely have it all.

[00:53:05] Jen: But the fact that you even recognize that Yeah. Speaks volumes to the maturity and wisdom that you've gained. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. 'cause there's a lot of people that would have that and don't even reconcile or recognize Yeah. That they have all the things they wanted.

[00:53:18] Samara: Yeah. For those things on, also, for anyone listening that are like, oh yeah, 2020 mes. Like, this is what I want. She's, it's not driving a ranger flying business class carrying a. Louis Vuitton, if that's what you want. It's what I want.

[00:53:30] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:53:31] Samara: But if you really think about the deep things that Abbe wanted, she wanted children.

Yeah. She wanted a loving relationship. She wanted a home, and she wanted a business that she adored with people that she adored inside. Yeah.

[00:53:42] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:53:43] Samara: It's not all of the materialistic things that have given Abbe what she wants in her life.

[00:53:48] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:53:48] Samara: It's all of the things that actually are.

Are

The things that make her who she is.

So really thinking into, even if you're in doing goals, what are they actually, what do they actually look like for you to be in a place that you're like 20-year-old, Abbe wanted this.

[00:54:04] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:54:05] Jen: And who are they? Because your goals were for you. Whereas sometimes I think people get lost in this goal and it's the goals for other people.

Yeah. It's what. They think people, you know, like I even see it with young people and their parents. My goal should be what my parents want for me, not necessarily what I want for me, for myself.

[00:54:22] Abbe: I do think too, it's so easy to get lost in social media and think like

what success looks like, whereas it should be what success feels like, I feel.

[00:54:33] Samara: Mm, agreed.

[00:54:34] Abbe: And I think once you learn that, that's when you can start building a, like a life that you want.

[00:54:40] Samara: One of the. Oh, f I'll finish on a final thing that keeps hitting me lately is

in a few centuries time, no one's gonna know. I, someone said, absolutely not someone. Someone listen. It's not

[00:54:50] Abbe: that serious.

[00:54:50] Samara: Someone listen to me. This one, it's not that deep. Yeah. A few centuries time, no one's gonna know who I am. No one's gonna know who the business was. No one's gonna know what LaSorella is. Yeah. No one's gonna know

gonna know what I did or how I lived or how, and. And that changes your perspective, that you're only living for you.

[00:55:06] Abbe: Literally.

[00:55:06] Samara: It's this one little precious life.

[00:55:08] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:55:09] Samara: And you've gotta find the deep purpose in it. Mm-hmm. For you, not for anybody else. So really internally reflect on like, what do I, if I get to 80? Mm-hmm. Like the fact that you are like, I'm about to step into 30 and I'm feeling this deep sense of everything I wanted, I achieved Oh my God.

And that is family and friendship and love.

[00:55:26] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:55:27] Samara: And who you are as a person.

[00:55:28] Abbe: Yeah.

[00:55:29] Samara: Full stop. Yeah. It's not everything you have, it's everything that you, it's not all the material stuff that you have. It's everything that you've got.

[00:55:35] Jen: Yeah.

[00:55:35] Samara: For you.

[00:55:36] Jen: Yeah.

[00:55:36] Samara: That is so, which is building that legacy. Your kids, your business.

But I think. You know, just think if, be scared sometimes to do those jumps and be uncomfortable because the worst thing that can happen is fail and no one's gonna remember it eventually anyway.

[00:55:51] Abbe: Exactly. Yeah,

[00:55:51] Jen: exactly.

[00:55:53] Samara: Like do it. Fail

[00:55:54] Jen: forward. Yeah,

[00:55:54] Samara: fail forward.

[00:55:56] Jen: I am. So excited to see, I don't wanna put this down.

See what the future holds. We're not putting Abbe down. We're bringing, we're lifting Abbe up and we're bringing her back. Yes. We'll just do little check-ins because I think that you are such a role model for young business owners. Yeah. Thank you. I am so happy that you have your little family with three little people and that little.

Bundle.

[00:56:19] Abbe: Oh, little

[00:56:20] Jen: turtle on the shark.

[00:56:21] Abbe: Little

[00:56:21] Jen: chunk.

[00:56:22] Abbe: Little chunk.

[00:56:22] Jen: Oh, chunk. He'll roll over eventually. Yeah. But um, yeah, we're so grateful and we're grateful that you put a baby that didn't want to go in the car and drove down to be with us today, because I know that's huge and we really, really appreciate

[00:56:35] Abbe: it.

Love. There was nowhere I wasn't coming. Oh,

[00:56:38] Jen: and we love you.

[00:56:40] Samara: Thank you for coming. Your insight honestly will help that many. You know what you just said of. The things that you learned mm-hmm. On a podcast. Mm-hmm. Yeah. You know, it's, that's the whole point of this podcast is something you just said has made someone else who's potentially a new mom or a mom going through it, or someone who's about to have babies or a FIFO Mom, go, I'm gonna put that fucking dishwasher on.

[00:57:01] Abbe: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You can do it. You can do it, babe. Anything you set your mind to, you've fucking got this. I love

[00:57:08] Samara: that. And also I, um, implore anyone who is listening to this and was like, I resonate so much with AB to get in touch her. Absolutely. She love it. Main

[00:57:16] Abbe: inbox is always open,

[00:57:18] Samara: you know, she will, because sharing when you've gone through something like that and then being able to share your.

A little bit of your insight story and your insight to what you've gone through and knowing that that journey actually helped others, makes the journey that you've been through. Yeah, a little less painful.

[00:57:35] Abbe: Yeah. And so it feels so much more worth it.

[00:57:37] Samara: Yeah.

[00:57:38] IMG_1979: Thank you.

[00:57:38] Samara: you. Thanks so much for listening guys.

[00:57:41] Jen: Thanks for coming, Abbe, we love you. You got the sweatiest all there and we will talk to you all soon. Bye.

Bye.